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Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:09 am
by Peter34_merc
One more from me, this one much simpler.

Currently, there are 9 things you can improve with Gems in equipment slots.

Daedalus also lets you train things, but only 8 of them. The 9th is absent. Why not add that into Daedalus' trainig curriculum, so that players can choose to spend some of their Hero Tokens on training their Hit Point totals up?

I understand that it's non-trivial to construct a game mechanical model for how that works. My very first idea for an implementation, which I immediately realized was overpowered, was to say that the training cost follows the same function as for the 8 currently trainable stats, 5 Tokens for the first level, 10 for the 2nd, 15 for the 3rd, and so forth, and each training level increases your HP total by your character level, with this bonus being updated as you level up (so that it doesn't matter when you bought the bonus. If you bought two bonuses at level 16, you're not stuck with that as a +32 HP bonus forever; rather as you level up to 17, it becomes a +34 bonus, and so forth).

That's clearly overpowered, because it'll allow any level 25 character to amass a huge amout of extra HP. And all I want - all I think is reasonable - is that players who desire it should be able to train up to increase their HP totals by a few hundred, maybe 600-700 at best, at a huge cost in Hero Tokens.

Two possibilities:

1. Use the same Hero Token cost progression, but the HP bonus is equal to level/4, all added together before you round the figure.

2. Stay with my initial idea of +character level HP per level of HP training, but the initial cost is 20 Hero Tokens rather than 5 Hero Tokens, and the 2nd level is 40 Tokens, 3rd level is 60, 4th is 80, and so forth. So essentially follow the same progression as for the 8 current trainables, but Hero Token cost is x4 higher.



I've long wanted to be able to train my character's Health up, because I've thought that the hit point totals were quite low relative to how many HP are healed by potions. Even after my Shadow Walker hit level 25, his HP total was still so low that I had to let my HP drop pretty close to dying, before I could fully utilize the 1250 HP healed by a large potion. Even Justicars don't have a lot of HP, even though one might presume that the base HP for a Justicar are higher than the base HP for a Shadow Walker of the same level.

And now, with the removal of in-combat HP regeneration in the upcoming 1.4 patch, the HP issue will become even more problematic. So I think adding in one more way to increase HP (beyond Gems, and the tiny 5% bonus you can get from your Guild) will be good.

It'll facilitate a wider range of play styles. Characters of the same class but specialized differently. One player might want to specialize his Justicar in +Magic and +Crit, while another player chooses to specialize his Justicar in +Health and +Haste.

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:14 pm
by Hotasfire0Coolasice
HP is needed mostly at low levels, so char level or level/4 would be EXTREMELY useless to levels 1-7. Once you hit around 15, HP is around 1.1K, allowing for the best pots to be used.

Maybe, but I don't think this idea would help low levels at all, maybe a Char Level amount of hero tokens * How many times this was used. So like 25/50/75/100/125/150/175/200 for your (char level + 5 / 3) boost in HP.

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:04 pm
by Brodog
Once you hit level 20 or so, you should be killing everything in around 3 or so attacks, you don't need health in the current game. I sell way more of the big health pots than I use, have no health gems, and rarely do I even need to use a health pot in a raid since things either die too fast to hit me or I can just use an interrupt.
I don't envision health being a concern for top level Players until possibly the advent of pvp...

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:43 pm
by GioRGiO
Brodog wrote:Once you hit level 20 or so, you should be killing everything in around 3 or so attacks, you don't need health in the current game. I sell way more of the big health pots than I use, have no health gems, and rarely do I even need to use a health pot in a raid since things either die too fast to hit me or I can just use an interrupt.
I don't envision health being a concern for top level Players until possibly the advent of pvp...


Totally agree, amount health is useless with the abundance of health potions and temple healing, until pvp.

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 11:43 am
by Peter34_merc
Hey, guys, I'm not talking about NOW, I'm talking about AFTER the v1.4 game update.

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:55 pm
by Bj_Knows
Peter34 wrote:
Even after my Shadow Walker hit level 25, his HP total was still so low that I had to let my HP drop pretty close to dying, before I could fully utilize the 1250 HP healed by a large potion.



Peter34 wrote:
And now, with the removal of in-combat HP regeneration in the upcoming 1.4 patch, the HP issue will become even more problematic. So I think adding in one more way to increase HP (beyond Gems, and the tiny 5% bonus you can get from your Guild) will be good.

.


When v1.3 came out, I bought 20 Tier 2 Gems for 4,000+ Health. Due to Raiding I then dropped to 10 Tier 2 Gems for 3,000+ Health. Now I have 2 Tier 3 Gems for 2,289 Health. Personally I like having 2,250+ Health. When my character drops below 1,000 Health I use a Large Healing Potion.

If you want +Max Health in v1.3, I currently recommend a Tier 1-3 Gem in your Ring Gem Slot B (5,000 Silver Piece to unlock slot) and Necklace Gem Slot C (25,000 Silver Piece to unlock slot).

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:32 pm
by GioRGiO
BjofCJandBj wrote:
Peter34 wrote:
Even after my Shadow Walker hit level 25, his HP total was still so low that I had to let my HP drop pretty close to dying, before I could fully utilize the 1250 HP healed by a large potion.



Peter34 wrote:
And now, with the removal of in-combat HP regeneration in the upcoming 1.4 patch, the HP issue will become even more problematic. So I think adding in one more way to increase HP (beyond Gems, and the tiny 5% bonus you can get from your Guild) will be good.

.


When v1.3 came out, I bought 20 Tier 2 Gems for 4,000+ Health. Due to Raiding I then dropped to 10 Tier 2 Gems for 3,000+ Health. Now I have 2 Tier 3 Gems for 2,289 Health. Personally I like having 2,250+ Health. When my character drops below 1,000 Health I use a Large Healing Potion.

If you want +Max Health in v1.3, I currently recommend a Tier 1-3 Gem in your Ring Gem Slot B (5,000 Silver Piece to unlock slot) and Necklace Gem Slot C (25,000 Silver Piece to unlock slot).


I don't use any health gems. They slow you down. Even after the update I doubt I will get hit enough to warrant using any so Im focusing on upping my other stats to increase my killing speed. Atm my war Mage has full t11 gear with 10 lvl4 gems and 20 lvl3. I can kill vallus (in raid) in a single crit hit now (>9k damage) which allows me not to get hit. It wouldbt matter if my health was 500 or 5000 at this point. I am looking forward to the update so that I can see if I will need any my lvl3 health gems that I have saved or of I should just sell them.

Re: Allow Hero Training for Health (HP)

PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:01 pm
by Elgonn
Why not just have each training add the same +8 as everything else. I admit it might take a long time to get a couple hundred extra health but health is totally worthless anyways.

Health Hero Training

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:25 pm
by Sim0n
I never understood why all the stats that come form gems could be increased with Hero Tokens, except Health. Could that training be added to the Training Hall?

Re: Health Hero Training

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:29 pm
by Shekka
Hey that would be a great use for the many many extra tokens I have laying around..